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* [Galene] Heads-up: built-in TURN server
@ 2021-01-18 21:26 Juliusz Chroboczek
  2021-01-18 21:38 ` [Galene] " Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  2021-01-19  8:33 ` Rémi Nollet
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Juliusz Chroboczek @ 2021-01-18 21:26 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: galene

I've just added an IPv-only TURN server to Galène.


# If you've already configured a TURN server and it works

Please add 

  -turn ""

to Galène's command line.


# If you're not currently running a TURN server

If you've got a global IP address on your server, a TURN server will
automagically appear the next time you update Galène.  Please make sure
that your firewall doesn't block port 1194 UDP or TCP, or else reconfigure
Galène to use a different port for TURN:

  -turn :1234

If your server is behind NAT, please make sure you forward ports 1194/UDP
and 1194/TCP in addition to port 8443, and tell Galène your global
(public) address:

  -turn 192.0.2.1:1194


# If you don't want to be running a TURN server

Disable Galène's built-in server by adding the following to the command
line:

  -turn ""


# Please help

Please read the new version of the README file, and let me know if there's
anything that's not clear enough.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 21:26 [Galene] Heads-up: built-in TURN server Juliusz Chroboczek
@ 2021-01-18 21:38 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  2021-01-18 21:44   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  2021-01-19  8:33 ` Rémi Nollet
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen @ 2021-01-18 21:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Juliusz Chroboczek, galene

Juliusz Chroboczek <jch@irif.fr> writes:

> I've just added an IPv-only TURN server to Galène.

Hah, of course you have! :)

Is there any benefit to switching to the built-in one if I already have
a working setup with an external TURN server?

-Toke

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 21:38 ` [Galene] " Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
@ 2021-01-18 21:44   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  2021-01-18 21:54     ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Juliusz Chroboczek @ 2021-01-18 21:44 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen; +Cc: galene

>> I've just added an IPv4-only TURN server to Galène.

> Is there any benefit to switching to the built-in one if I already have
> a working setup with an external TURN server?

None at all, and you'd lose IPv6 support.

-- Juliusz

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 21:44   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
@ 2021-01-18 21:54     ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  2021-01-18 22:03       ` Michael Ströder
  2021-01-18 22:04       ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen @ 2021-01-18 21:54 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Juliusz Chroboczek; +Cc: galene

Juliusz Chroboczek <jch@irif.fr> writes:

>>> I've just added an IPv4-only TURN server to Galène.
>
>> Is there any benefit to switching to the built-in one if I already have
>> a working setup with an external TURN server?
>
> None at all, and you'd lose IPv6 support.

Right, gotcha!

In that case, would it not be better to only start up the built-in TURN
server if no explicit turn server config is present, instead of
requiring a command-line option to turn it off?

-Toke

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 21:54     ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
@ 2021-01-18 22:03       ` Michael Ströder
  2021-01-18 22:04       ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Michael Ströder @ 2021-01-18 22:03 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: galene

On 1/18/21 10:54 PM, Toke Høiland-Jørgensen wrote:
> Juliusz Chroboczek <jch@irif.fr> writes:
> 
>>>> I've just added an IPv4-only TURN server to Galène.
>>
>>> Is there any benefit to switching to the built-in one if I already have
>>> a working setup with an external TURN server?
>>
>> None at all, and you'd lose IPv6 support.
> 
> In that case, would it not be better to only start up the built-in TURN
> server if no explicit turn server config is present, instead of
> requiring a command-line option to turn it off?

I'd also prefer to disable the built-in TURN server by default.

Ciao, Michael.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 21:54     ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  2021-01-18 22:03       ` Michael Ströder
@ 2021-01-18 22:04       ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  2021-01-18 22:27         ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Juliusz Chroboczek @ 2021-01-18 22:04 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen; +Cc: galene

>>> Is there any benefit to switching to the built-in one if I already have
>>> a working setup with an external TURN server?

>> None at all, and you'd lose IPv6 support.

> In that case, would it not be better to only start up the built-in TURN
> server if no explicit turn server config is present, instead of
> requiring a command-line option to turn it off?

If the built-in server is enabled, it will be injected at the end of the
ICE configuration, your external server will be used first, with fallback
to the built-in server if connectivity cannot be established through the
external server.

If the built-in server is enabled and uses the same port as your external
server, then the bind() call will fail (EADDRINUSE), you'll get a friendly
log message, and the built-in server will be disabled.

The only troublesome case is if the ports are the same, and Galène is
started before the external TURN server, in which case the external TURN
server won't be able to bind its ports.

I find the current behaviour simpler to explain than what you suggest, and
I'm trying to optimise for simplicity.  I'm open to different opinions,
though, especially if you find any catastrophic failure modes with the
current defaults.

-- Juliusz

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 22:04       ` Juliusz Chroboczek
@ 2021-01-18 22:27         ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  2021-01-18 22:37           ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen @ 2021-01-18 22:27 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Juliusz Chroboczek; +Cc: galene

Juliusz Chroboczek <jch@irif.fr> writes:

>>>> Is there any benefit to switching to the built-in one if I already have
>>>> a working setup with an external TURN server?
>
>>> None at all, and you'd lose IPv6 support.
>
>> In that case, would it not be better to only start up the built-in TURN
>> server if no explicit turn server config is present, instead of
>> requiring a command-line option to turn it off?
>
> If the built-in server is enabled, it will be injected at the end of the
> ICE configuration, your external server will be used first, with fallback
> to the built-in server if connectivity cannot be established through the
> external server.
>
> If the built-in server is enabled and uses the same port as your external
> server, then the bind() call will fail (EADDRINUSE), you'll get a friendly
> log message, and the built-in server will be disabled.
>
> The only troublesome case is if the ports are the same, and Galène is
> started before the external TURN server, in which case the external TURN
> server won't be able to bind its ports.
>
> I find the current behaviour simpler to explain than what you suggest, and
> I'm trying to optimise for simplicity.  I'm open to different opinions,
> though, especially if you find any catastrophic failure modes with the
> current defaults.

What about when the external TURN server is on a different IP, so Galene
has no problem starting up the internal one, but it's firewalled off to
clients can't connect to it? In that case presumably it'll just be
another TURN candidate offered to clients which will fail? Isn't that
bad for latency (I think Firefox emits a warning recommending a max of
two candidates)?

-Toke

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 22:27         ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
@ 2021-01-18 22:37           ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  2021-01-18 23:05             ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Juliusz Chroboczek @ 2021-01-18 22:37 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen; +Cc: galene

> What about when the external TURN server is on a different IP, so Galene
> has no problem starting up the internal one, but it's firewalled off to
> clients can't connect to it? In that case presumably it'll just be
> another TURN candidate offered to clients which will fail?

The external TURN server will be tried first, so the latency of successful
connections will not increase.  You'll just take more time to fail.

> (I think Firefox emits a warning recommending a max of two candidates)?

Yeah, I'm not sure why.  I see no reason for that in the ICE spec, but
perhaps Firefox are doing proprietary magic.

At any rate, I'd expect somebody who goes through the trouble of setting
up an instance of coturn to be willing to add a command-line option to
Galène.  I'd like to understand why you and Michael appear to disagree,
perhaps I'm missing something obvious.

-- Juliusz

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 22:37           ` Juliusz Chroboczek
@ 2021-01-18 23:05             ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  2021-01-18 23:39               ` Michael Ströder
  2021-01-19  0:22               ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen @ 2021-01-18 23:05 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Juliusz Chroboczek; +Cc: galene

Juliusz Chroboczek <jch@irif.fr> writes:

>> What about when the external TURN server is on a different IP, so Galene
>> has no problem starting up the internal one, but it's firewalled off to
>> clients can't connect to it? In that case presumably it'll just be
>> another TURN candidate offered to clients which will fail?
>
> The external TURN server will be tried first, so the latency of successful
> connections will not increase.  You'll just take more time to fail.

Right, OK.

>> (I think Firefox emits a warning recommending a max of two candidates)?
>
> Yeah, I'm not sure why.  I see no reason for that in the ICE spec, but
> perhaps Firefox are doing proprietary magic.
>
> At any rate, I'd expect somebody who goes through the trouble of setting
> up an instance of coturn to be willing to add a command-line option to
> Galène.  I'd like to understand why you and Michael appear to disagree,
> perhaps I'm missing something obvious.

Sure, I can add it, of course :)

It's just a bit of extra work; specifically, I have to go in and update
the systemd unit file on update, and if I wasn't paying attention to the
mailing list I would likely have missed this addition and end up running
with a "broken" config.

And also, from a "least surprise" PoV I think it's a bit odd to
second-guess the user: if I configured a list of TURN servers, I would
expect that that is the list that would be used, and not have it amended
without an explicit opt-in.

Just to be clear, I think turning on the TURN server by default is
totally fine to make it easier to deploy Galene! It's only the "override
user config" aspect I'm objecting to (and it's not a terribly strong
objection, at that).

-Toke

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 23:05             ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
@ 2021-01-18 23:39               ` Michael Ströder
  2021-01-19  0:22               ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Michael Ströder @ 2021-01-18 23:39 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: galene

On 1/19/21 12:05 AM, Toke Høiland-Jørgensen wrote:
> Juliusz Chroboczek <jch@irif.fr> writes:
> 
>>> What about when the external TURN server is on a different IP, so Galene
>>> has no problem starting up the internal one, but it's firewalled off to
>>> clients can't connect to it? In that case presumably it'll just be
>>> another TURN candidate offered to clients which will fail?
>>
>> The external TURN server will be tried first, so the latency of successful
>> connections will not increase.  You'll just take more time to fail.
> 
> Right, OK.
> 
>>> (I think Firefox emits a warning recommending a max of two candidates)?
>>
>> Yeah, I'm not sure why.  I see no reason for that in the ICE spec, but
>> perhaps Firefox are doing proprietary magic.
>>
>> At any rate, I'd expect somebody who goes through the trouble of setting
>> up an instance of coturn to be willing to add a command-line option to
>> Galène.  I'd like to understand why you and Michael appear to disagree,
>> perhaps I'm missing something obvious.
> 
> Sure, I can add it, of course :)
> 
> It's just a bit of extra work; 
> [..]
> Just to be clear, I think turning on the TURN server by default is
> totally fine to make it easier to deploy Galene! It's only the "override
> user config" aspect I'm objecting to (and it's not a terribly strong
> objection, at that).

Toke summarized my own feelings, maybe just an emotional over-reaction
against opening an unneeded service port. ;-)

Just go ahead with whatever you consider appropriate.

Ciao, Michael.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 23:05             ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  2021-01-18 23:39               ` Michael Ströder
@ 2021-01-19  0:22               ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  2021-01-19 11:47                 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Juliusz Chroboczek @ 2021-01-19  0:22 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen; +Cc: galene

Ok, I disagree with you guys, but I've done as you say.

The built-in TURN server will be disabled by default if there's an
ice-servers.json file (even if it's empty or otherwise malformed).  This
won't happen if the -turn option has been explicitly specified on the
command-line.

The server should be started if the ice-servers.json file disappears, but
I haven't actually tested that it works, and haven't written any unit tests.

That's way more magic than I like, but perhaps you guys are right.
I sincerely don't know.

-- Juliusz

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-18 21:26 [Galene] Heads-up: built-in TURN server Juliusz Chroboczek
  2021-01-18 21:38 ` [Galene] " Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
@ 2021-01-19  8:33 ` Rémi Nollet
  2021-01-19 11:00   ` Gabriel Kerneis
  2021-01-19 11:21   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  1 sibling, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Rémi Nollet @ 2021-01-19  8:33 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: galene

On 18/01/2021 22:26, Juliusz Chroboczek wrote:
> Please read the new version of the README file, and let me know if there's
> anything that's not clear enough.

“TURN is a superset of NAT” ~> I guess you meant a superset of STUN?

(By the way, thank you for this precision. I spent some time trying to 
figure that out, the first time.)

(Also, I preferred your dad’s previous password. :-) )

-- Rémi

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-19  8:33 ` Rémi Nollet
@ 2021-01-19 11:00   ` Gabriel Kerneis
  2021-01-19 11:21   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Gabriel Kerneis @ 2021-01-19 11:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: galene

On Tue, 19 Jan 2021, at 09:33, Rémi Nollet wrote:
> On 18/01/2021 22:26, Juliusz Chroboczek wrote:
> > Please read the new version of the README file, and let me know if there's
> > anything that's not clear enough.
> 
> “TURN is a superset of NAT” ~> I guess you meant a superset of STUN?

By the way, if you're as confused as I was about STUN/TURN/NAT etc., I found this blog post enlightening:
https://tailscale.com/blog/how-nat-traversal-works/

-- 
Gabriel

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-19  8:33 ` Rémi Nollet
  2021-01-19 11:00   ` Gabriel Kerneis
@ 2021-01-19 11:21   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Juliusz Chroboczek @ 2021-01-19 11:21 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Rémi Nollet; +Cc: galene

> “TURN is a superset of NAT” ~> I guess you meant a superset of STUN?

Yep, thanks.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-19  0:22               ` Juliusz Chroboczek
@ 2021-01-19 11:47                 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  2021-01-19 11:52                   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen @ 2021-01-19 11:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Juliusz Chroboczek; +Cc: galene

Juliusz Chroboczek <jch@irif.fr> writes:

> Ok, I disagree with you guys, but I've done as you say.
>
> The built-in TURN server will be disabled by default if there's an
> ice-servers.json file (even if it's empty or otherwise malformed).  This
> won't happen if the -turn option has been explicitly specified on the
> command-line.

That sounds reasonable, thanks :)

> The server should be started if the ice-servers.json file disappears, but
> I haven't actually tested that it works, and haven't written any unit
> tests.

It does appear to, once someone enters a conference:

root@video:/var/lib/galene# ss -ntpl | grep galene
LISTEN    0         128                      *:443                    *:*        users:(("galene",pid=793998,fd=6))                                             
root@video:/var/lib/galene# ss -nupl | grep galene
root@video:/var/lib/galene# mv data/ice-servers.json .
root@video:/var/lib/galene# ss -ntpl | grep galene
LISTEN    0         128                      *:443                    *:*        users:(("galene",pid=793998,fd=6))                                             
root@video:/var/lib/galene# ss -nupl | grep galene

So nothing, but after entering a conference and turning on video it does
appear to enable itself:

root@video:/var/lib/galene# ss -nupl | grep galene
UNCONN    0         0              45.145.95.8:1194             0.0.0.0:*        users:(("galene",pid=794316,fd=9))


It even turns itself off again if I restore the file:
root@video:/var/lib/galene# mv ice-servers.json data/
(enter conference)
root@video:/var/lib/galene# ss -nupl | grep galene

> That's way more magic than I like, but perhaps you guys are right.
> I sincerely don't know.

I like it - "sufficiently advanced technology being indistinguishable
from magic" and all that :)

-Toke

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-19 11:47                 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
@ 2021-01-19 11:52                   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  2021-01-19 12:12                     ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Juliusz Chroboczek @ 2021-01-19 11:52 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen; +Cc: galene

> I like it - "sufficiently advanced technology being indistinguishable
> from magic" and all that :)

Except that now I'm trying to update the README, and I'm finding the
behaviour impossible to explain concisely.  I need to think.

-- Juliusz

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-19 11:52                   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
@ 2021-01-19 12:12                     ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  2021-01-19 12:37                       ` Michael Ströder
  2021-01-19 12:48                       ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen @ 2021-01-19 12:12 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Juliusz Chroboczek; +Cc: galene

Juliusz Chroboczek <jch@irif.fr> writes:

>> I like it - "sufficiently advanced technology being indistinguishable
>> from magic" and all that :)
>
> Except that now I'm trying to update the README, and I'm finding the
> behaviour impossible to explain concisely.  I need to think.

How about:

"Galene contains a built-in TURN implementation. By default, this
built-in TURN server will be turned on only if no explicit TURN server
configuration exists (in the form of an 'ice-servers.json' configuration
file). To override this default behaviour, the TURN server can be
explicitly turned on by specifying a listening argument on the command
line, such as '-turn :1194'. It can be explicitly turned off by
specifying an empty argument, i.e. '-turn ""'."

-Toke

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-19 12:12                     ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
@ 2021-01-19 12:37                       ` Michael Ströder
  2021-01-19 12:48                       ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Michael Ströder @ 2021-01-19 12:37 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: galene

On 1/19/21 1:12 PM, Toke Høiland-Jørgensen wrote:
> Juliusz Chroboczek <jch@irif.fr> writes:
> 
>>> I like it - "sufficiently advanced technology being indistinguishable
>>> from magic" and all that :)
>>
>> Except that now I'm trying to update the README, and I'm finding the
>> behaviour impossible to explain concisely.  I need to think.
> 
> How about:
> 
> "Galene contains a built-in TURN implementation. By default, this
> built-in TURN server will be turned on only if no explicit TURN server
> configuration exists (in the form of an 'ice-servers.json' configuration
> file). To override this default behaviour, the TURN server can be
> explicitly turned on by specifying a listening argument on the command
> line, such as '-turn :1194'. It can be explicitly turned off by
> specifying an empty argument, i.e. '-turn ""'."

Sounds good to me. Also the implemented behaviour is something a distro
packager can easily accept as installation default.

Ciao, Michael.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-19 12:12                     ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  2021-01-19 12:37                       ` Michael Ströder
@ 2021-01-19 12:48                       ` Juliusz Chroboczek
  2021-01-19 13:07                         ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 20+ messages in thread
From: Juliusz Chroboczek @ 2021-01-19 12:48 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen; +Cc: galene

>> Except that now I'm trying to update the README, and I'm finding the
>> behaviour impossible to explain concisely.  I need to think.

> How about:

I think the problem is that the default value is not materialised — the
magic depends on whether the option was explicitly specified, the default
value does not correspond to any possible value of the command-line option.

I think the solution lies in making an explicit default value.  I'm
thinking of "-turn auto" being the default, and behaving as we do
currently if the option was not specified.  This is easier to explain,
gives a clearer mental image to the user, and has the added advantage of
being extensible -- people can hardly complain if the "auto" behaviour
changes between versions.

(I'm must resist the temptation of calling the value "magic".)

-- Juliusz

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

* [Galene] Re: Heads-up: built-in TURN server
  2021-01-19 12:48                       ` Juliusz Chroboczek
@ 2021-01-19 13:07                         ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 20+ messages in thread
From: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen @ 2021-01-19 13:07 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Juliusz Chroboczek; +Cc: galene

Juliusz Chroboczek <jch@irif.fr> writes:

>>> Except that now I'm trying to update the README, and I'm finding the
>>> behaviour impossible to explain concisely.  I need to think.
>
>> How about:
>
> I think the problem is that the default value is not materialised — the
> magic depends on whether the option was explicitly specified, the default
> value does not correspond to any possible value of the command-line option.
>
> I think the solution lies in making an explicit default value.  I'm
> thinking of "-turn auto" being the default, and behaving as we do
> currently if the option was not specified.  This is easier to explain,
> gives a clearer mental image to the user, and has the added advantage of
> being extensible -- people can hardly complain if the "auto" behaviour
> changes between versions.

Right, no objection to that!

> (I'm must resist the temptation of calling the value "magic".)

You could call it 'automagic'? ;)

-Toke

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 20+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2021-01-19 13:07 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 20+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2021-01-18 21:26 [Galene] Heads-up: built-in TURN server Juliusz Chroboczek
2021-01-18 21:38 ` [Galene] " Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2021-01-18 21:44   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
2021-01-18 21:54     ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2021-01-18 22:03       ` Michael Ströder
2021-01-18 22:04       ` Juliusz Chroboczek
2021-01-18 22:27         ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2021-01-18 22:37           ` Juliusz Chroboczek
2021-01-18 23:05             ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2021-01-18 23:39               ` Michael Ströder
2021-01-19  0:22               ` Juliusz Chroboczek
2021-01-19 11:47                 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2021-01-19 11:52                   ` Juliusz Chroboczek
2021-01-19 12:12                     ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2021-01-19 12:37                       ` Michael Ströder
2021-01-19 12:48                       ` Juliusz Chroboczek
2021-01-19 13:07                         ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2021-01-19  8:33 ` Rémi Nollet
2021-01-19 11:00   ` Gabriel Kerneis
2021-01-19 11:21   ` Juliusz Chroboczek

Galène videoconferencing server discussion list archives

This inbox may be cloned and mirrored by anyone:

	git clone --mirror https://lists.galene.org/galene

	# If you have public-inbox 1.1+ installed, you may
	# initialize and index your mirror using the following commands:
	public-inbox-init -V1 galene galene/ https://lists.galene.org/galene \
		galene@lists.galene.org
	public-inbox-index galene

Example config snippet for mirrors.


AGPL code for this site: git clone https://public-inbox.org/public-inbox.git